Wednesday, September 3, 2008

Musings on demographic history

Clio: So, darling, are you going to respond to Agnostic's challenge or not?

CM: You mean when he asked me to link to some statistics about marriage patterns in history, in order to dispel the popular misconception that it was once common for girls to marry in their teens? Well, I'm thinking about it, but I'm not quite certain how to approach the business. Agnostic was especially concerned by bloggers who are making this comment in order to lend their support to Sarah Palin and her daughter, who is expecting a child at age seventeen. The thing is, I haven't been able to find any such bloggers online, and so I don't know exactly what their arguments are or what sort of shark-pool I'd be jumping into if I comment on them. Plus, I'm wavering again on the idea of writing a post on so political a subject. Not my country, not my election, not my issue.

Clio: Apollo save us! You have something there right now, do you not, that summarizes the basic information for you? I mean, you don't even have to think about it. Just paste it in and forget about what's-her-name for the moment. Anyway, haven't you been itching to correct young Roissy and his angry hordes on this very subject - early marriage - for months?

CM: Oh, all right. When you put it that way it seems silly to hold back. It's not as if I'm invading anyone's privacy or anything. The following summary is from an online article quoting respectable academic sources. Here goes:
Fertility Control through Late Marriage
Daniel Scott Smith has summarized the findings of thirty-eight family reconstitution studies (twenty-seven of which described French villages from the late seventeenth and eighteenth centuries) as follows: "A woman who married at age 20 exactly, and survived to age 45 with her husband would bear nine children" (p. 22). Thus the potential maximum fertility was only about half of Leridon's biological maximum. And what is more, Smith's potential maximum fertility is an overstatement for two reasons: first, the average age at first marriage for northwestern European women was not twenty and second about one-third of all marriages were broken by the death of one partner before age forty-five, which Smith is using as a shorthand measurement for the onset of menopause. In Smith's sample of thirty-eight villages, for example, the average age at first marriage for women was 25.7 years old; their husbands were 28.0 years old.

Basing his conclusions on fifty-four published studies describing age-specific marital fertility rates for women in early modern northwestern Europe, Michael Flinn agrees with Smith, describing an average age at first marriage for women that fluctuated around twenty-five. Flinn does not provide us with measurements to assess the spread of the distribution around this midpoint, but other studies have determined the standard deviation to be about six years, meaning that about two-thirds of all northwestern European women married for the first time between twenty-two and twenty-eight. A few teenaged brides were counterbalanced, as it were, by a similar number of women who married in their thirties. Perhaps one woman in ten never married. In the demographer's jargon, that tenth woman was permanently celibate.

So in answering our question concerning the relative lowness of high birth rates, the first point we have to keep in view is that, uniquely, northwestern Europeans married late. Or, to be more precise, the link between PUBERTY and marriage was dramatically more attenuated in early modern northwestern Europe than elsewhere. Modern demographic studies have shown that in eastern and southern Europe this puberty-marriage gap was about half as long, while in most African and Asian countries puberty and marriage roughly coincided as a girl entered womanhood (and adult status) with the onset of menstruation. Arranged marriages followed almost immediately thereafter.

The identification of this austere Malthusian regime has been the greatest achievement of early modern historical demography. These statistics provide us with a single measure that distinguishes the creation of new families in northwestern Europe from other societies. This unique marriage strategy was vitally important for two reasons: first, it provided a safety valve, or margin for error, in the ongoing adjustment between population and resources that characterized the reproduction of generations and social formations; and second it meant that the role of women was less dependent and vulnerable insofar as they were marrying as young adults, not older children. Arranged marriages were normal among the propertied Europeans, as they were in almost every other part of the world; most of these marriages were arranged while the girl was still a child and they were formalized after puberty.

CM: Notice that, dear readers. Various studies indicate that the average age at marriage in northwestern Europe was about 25 for women and 28 for men, long after puberty for both sexes. That average was lower in eastern and southern Europe, but still not as early as puberty. Only the daughters of the well-to-do married that early, and they were never a large proportion of the population. Notice, also, that this is regarded by demographic historians as a "unique" marriage pattern. No other regional population on earth followed such an "austere regime", as the author of this piece puts it. And finally, of course, there's the fact that the supposed female preference for alpha males had no part in these marriage patterns. Rich or poor, parents tended to make the choice of mate for the young. Perhaps alpha male fathers chose alpha mates for their daughters, but who knows? It doesn't seem likely. Money and propinquity (though not kinship, as in other societies) were more important to parents. And building the family's status up over time, if possible, through careful marriage.

Clio: I wonder why those evolutionary biologists, and IQ theorists, and so on, aren't more attentive to this issue.

CM: I don't know. But you'd certainly expect that people so interested in the unique particularities of ethnic groups and populations would be fascinated by this information, that it would be a cornerstone of their thinking on the subject of racial and ethnic differences. Of course, they'd almost certainly insist that the reasons for this unique pattern of sexual continence were purely genetic. A very dull explanation, and in this case almost certainly not the truth, or not the greater part of the truth.

Clio: Why do you say that, my sweet?

CM: Because the limited sources available suggest, if I am remembering correctly, that before the arrival of Christianity in Europe, its various ethnic and tribal groups married their children off young. The Romans and Greeks married their daughters at puberty, though not usually their sons, who had to wait a longer time. They resorted to exposure and infanticide to control fertility, but that was forbidden by Christianity, as was abortion, so families had to find some other way to ensure that they could feed their children. The article I linked to suggests that infanticide was the usual approach to the problem of too many children in China and Japan as well.

Clio: There you are now. You've written a fair bit here, and not one word of it could be interpreted as a political diatribe.

CM: Ah, that's your influence there, Clio. You keep my mind on Parnassus, and away from the passing excitements of everyday life among mortals.

24 comments:

agnostic said...

Minor correction on that quote -- if 2/3 of women married between 22 and 28, with the average at 25, that makes the standard deviation 3 years, not 6 years.

I'll emphasize one of the key points for the guy readers: Southeastern Europe is where to go for young babes, Greece especially.

Evolutionary biologists study how individuals adapt genetically as well as "facultatively" -- in real time, on-the-fly, etc. In fact, that what most evo psych people say are the cause of race differences -- not genetic differences, but people adapting on-the-fly to environmental differences.

Right in some cases, wrong in others; it's up to us to figure it out.

There is a gene whose variants influence how far apart a woman's births are spaced, and there's probably some other genetic influence on when a woman decides to have kids.

Genetic change can happen quickly: Ashkenazi Jews were not who they are now before they occupied a white collar niche, and there's a suite of genetic idiosyncrasies they have, all in a few biochemical pathways linked to nervous system function, that make them smarter than other groups on average.

Something similar probably happened in Early Modern Europe (Gregory Clark's argument in *A Farewell to Alms*). What we consider middle class values, like marrying late and to a partner who isn't much older than you, could reflect genetic changes in personality, temperament, reproductive strategy, etc. These all have genetic bases.

That's why I've become so fascinated with the Early Modern period -- it's the most promising for finding really recent natural selection.

agnostic said...

Re: your puzzlement about why evo-minded people don't talk a lot about these marriage patterns, the evo psych people think that "recent" developments are largely irrelevant to their concerns -- the Stone Age is what mattered.

Behavioral ecologists, a related group, study how people adapt here and now, so they may have written some things.

But modern Europe just isn't a sexy study topic -- hunter-gatherers, pastoralists, OK. Speculation about Stone Age Europeans, OK. But very few think it's acceptable, or think it's OK but just boring, to study historical Europe.

Hopefully Gregory Clark's book will change that. I sure intend to.

Anonymous said...

Thanks, Agnostic. To tell you the truth, I was really wondering why Steve Sailer - a statistician rather than an evolutionary biologist, but who professes to have an interest in these matters - hasn't written about this, as far as I can tell.

Perhaps it isn't inflammatory enough for him? I don't think he is the deranged "far-right" racist some people believe, but I do think that he likes to present the results of his reading in this area in a way calculated to annoy people as much as possible. Almost always pleasantly - but still, in a way intended to get under people's skin.

I have no idea how seriously to take him because I am not well-read in his fields of interest and can make no judgment about their quality. He draws some conclusions I find incredible - like his suggestion somewhere that the scope for the evolution of intelligence (esp. in certain races) is probably finite - at least, without intermarriage with peoples of higher IQ. That sounds positively fantastic (i.e., from the realm of fantasy) to me. I mean, given the way evolution has produced such a vast range of species starting from a few organic molecules, how on earth can anyone make such a prediction with any confidence?

When he says things like that, I do find myself wondering whether he isn't a race-baiter after all. I'm even more uncomfortable when some people start talking about how IQ is fundamentally connected to certain basic moral qualities like self-control. But perhaps you believe all this too? I don't know. I think scientists probably have much to learn about these matters still, and it's a mistake to draw conclusions too soon.

About Gregory Clark - he has been severely criticized by historians for not knowing his history well enough - too much an economist, too little an historian. Without having read AFTA, I can't say, but I'm inclined to suspect he is making a number of mistakes through lack of familiarity with certain areas of history. I keep looking for that wretched book in Ottawa shops but haven't found it yet, and I dislike ordering books online unless I absolutely must.

Clio

PatrickH said...

Why do you not like ordering online Clio? I do it through amazon, a friend uses ABE books. They deliver promptly, they're cheap, and you can get almost anything.

I'm not sure what you mean about Sailer arguing that the scope for evolution of intelligence is finite, especially in certain races. I just don't have a sense of what you mean by that.

IQ is strongly correlated with a whole range of positive social outcomes. Audacious Epigone has links to studies somewhere, Linda Gottfredson has done research for years now on the relation of g to things like positive health outcomes, susceptibility to accidents, and much else. It's too easy to say high IQ and "morality" are "connected", if you mean you have to have the first to have the second. But there is a connection. Agnostic can tell you much much more about this than I.

Alias Clio said...

I mean that somewhere or other he appears to say (if I'm remembering correctly) that it's not likely that the IQ of sub-Saharan African peoples, for example, is likely to evolve much above its present, relatively low level; that it might improve somewhat with better diet during gestation and early childhood but will likely not improve much beyond a certain point (unspecified) through evolution; that the capacity of the IQ of any race of people to evolve is probably finite. As I said, I see no way that anyone could expect such a prediction to be accurate.

I'm not certain why that comment was so difficult to understand. Sorry. Don't mean to be rude. I just don't see it.

IQ is strongly correlated with a whole range of positive social outcomes.

Yes, so I've been told. I'm sure they're right, under the terms in which they've set the discussion. I'm just not convinced that they're not missing something here. Plus, I believe high IQ people, esp. those of really high IQ, can pose their own kind of danger to society; I get tired of reading all about the danger posed by people of low IQ. Even if that were true, what on earth could society as a whole be expected to do about it? Sterilization of the "unfit"? I can see no just or democratic solution to this problem, if indeed it is a problem.

Clio

PA said...

Even if that were true, what on earth could society as a whole be expected to do about it?

How about no longer subsidizing their growing numbers via welfare and immigration?

Anonymous said...

There are legitimate reasons to ask for restrictions on immigration. It would be morally distasteful and politically impossible to demand that these restrictions be imposed on members of particular races or ethnic groups, while permitting others easy access. If you want to ensure that your immigrants have high IQs, why not demand that they meet a higher standard of education?

As for welfare, I've come to believe that it can be harmful, especially if it's extended on terms that encourage women to have children without fathers, but I wouldn't want it to disappear altogether.

Clio

Anonymous said...

p.s. Even better than demanding only that immigrants have advanced degrees, which after all doesn't guarantee employability, is demanding that they have specific skills.

Both can be tricky, though. Canada's immigration system seeks out educated immigrants, but once they arrive they often find all kinds of barriers to using their skills in the workplace. Professional associations of doctors, engineers, teachers and so forth often try to protect themselves against competition of this kind by demanding special certification from immigrants. It seems unfair to invite people in because they have engineering degrees and then tell them once they arrive, "No, we won't let you work in your field unless you go back to school and get certified or upgraded to work in Canada."

Clio

PA said...

It would be morally distasteful and politically impossible to demand that these restrictions be imposed on members of particular races or ethnic groups, while permitting others easy access.

I profoundly disagree.

Race and culure matter. For example, Korea would be best served by not having any immigration, ever. But if they have to have any, they would be better off having (relatively) similar-looking Vietnamese move in, rather than me and one-million of my Slavic cousins, whatever our IQs or educational levels may be.

The notion that immigration is a "right" and that controlling it in any way that's beneficial to the host polulatuion is immoral, is a brand-new notion.

Anonymous said...

Of course culture matters, and I suppose I'm willing to accept that race matters too, in the sense that multi-racial or multi-ethnic societies tend to be fractious and polarized, especially those in which various races/groups specialize in particular economic functions. (I'm thinking Vietnamese farmers vs ethnic Chinese merchants here.)

It's true, too, that immigration is not a right. And I did not suggest that it's immoral to control it for the benefit of the host nation. Didn't you catch what I said about requiring that immigrants possess education or skills? I don't think, however, that you could get away with making race as such a condition of entry into the US, supposing that's what you want. For one thing, the US is already a mixed-race society, and always has been. You cannot ban African immigrants, for example, on the grounds of their race without grossly offending the nation's original African-American population. They may be a minority, but their votes still count. In any case such a move would greatly aggravate the existing suspicion and hostility between Black and non-Black Americans.

Aside from that issue, Americans are a major presence in expatriate communities throughout the world; they also like to travel and vacation abroad. Let the word get out that non-white immigrants are not welcome in the US and those tourists and expatriates may suddenly be refused entry or find themselves unwelcome to do business abroad. Forgive me, PA, but have a bit of sense, man.

Clio

PA said...

As far as I know, I am not allowed to immigrate to India (along with one million of my Slavic cousins) unless I am of Indian descent.

I am, however free to visit and then leave.

The moral of your point about America already being multiethnic is that if you want to keep your country, don't ever crack the door open, lest a couple of your new citizens will be offended when you try to shut it.

RedSalamander said...

Getting back to Clio's original point re: whether or not teen marriage was commonplace in times past:

When I was researching my family tree, I was rather surprised to find that most of my female ancestors married around age 20-25. That seemed older than I would have expected, especially for 18th century mountain folk. After all, hillbillies all get married at 14, right? Since the "average" lifespan in those days was 45, a 15 year old must have been the equivalent of a 30 year old now, right?

I did a little more research and learned that the average age for a woman to get married was indeed around 20-25, with men being somewhat older. Why so late? For one thing, the average age of menarche was around 16; unlike today when it is not uncommon for 10 year olds to get their periods.

For another thing, while the "average" life expectancy was much lower than today, that does not mean that people aged at an accelerated rate. The average was low, because of the extremely high rate of mortality among infants and young children in those pre-antibiotic, pre-vaccine days. But for those who survived childhood, you had a reasonable chance of living 70-80 years -- just like we do today. My father's family was known for their longeveity; my great-grandma (born in 1880) lived to be 100, and most of my 18th and 19th century kin reached 70 or older, in spite of having almost no medical care in their remote mountain "holler" and lives spent bearing anywhere from six to twenty children while tending farms and fending off Indian attacks.

According to "Farewell to Alms," the average age of marriage for women before 1790 was 25.2 in England, 25.3 in France, 26.5 in the Netherlands and 26.6 in Germany. Sounds strangely modern, doesn't it? Keep in mind that most people did not marry until they could afford to; not in the modern sense of blowing $30K on a wedding, but in the sense of owning some property or establishing a trade. Men knew they couldn't seriously court a bride without having some way of supporting her and their future children, and women were pragmatic enough to realize that living with their parents as spinsters was generally preferable to marrying a man with no means of income.

In good economic times, marriages tended to be earlier. Likewise, outbreaks of war often saw a flurry of young marriages as people realized there was a good chance the young men would not return, and it was considered better to be a widow than a spinster. But these were not the general rule; Scarlett O'Hara lamented her impulsive marriage at 16; Laura Ingalls noted with shock an acquaintance who wed at 13 suggesting that even on the frontier, it was neither normal nor respectable.

The reason we have this idea that our ancestors married at 14 is probably due to the fact that royalty often did, for political purposes. However, we cannot extrapolate the habits of normal folks from a small, elite segment of society. The majority of modern Americans do not live quite like Paris Hilton; and just because princesses often became child brides does not mean that the average farm girl did.

Peter said...

I've long been of the opinion that the optimal IQ score is in the 110 to 125 range, perhaps up to 130, but not higher. While of course low intelligence can be associated with a whole host of problems, being too smart has its disadvantages too. Extremely intelligent people all too often have social-adjustment difficulties. Whether this is due to their difficulty in finding sufficient numbers of people of equal intellect with whom to interact, or whether there's something inherent in their mindsets, I'm not sure.

Anonymous said...

I mean that somewhere or other he appears to say (if I'm remembering correctly) that it's not likely that the IQ of sub-Saharan African peoples, for example, is likely to evolve much above its present, relatively low level; that it might improve somewhat with better diet during gestation and early childhood but will likely not improve much beyond a certain point (unspecified) through evolution; that the capacity of the IQ of any race of people to evolve is probably finite. As I said, I see no way that anyone could expect such a prediction to be accurate.

This is a really garbled account of Steve Sailer's thoughts on the matter. At the risk of setting off another series of attacks on myself, I do think you need to read more books on evolutionary theory, which I don't think you quite understand. There is a nice list of books over at Gene expression and most of them are pretty fun reads, though I haven't attempted some of the more math heavy ones.

Thursday

PatrickH said...

Clio, my difficulty was in understanding your use of the word "evolve". Sailer has never said there are limits on how high African IQs could "evolve". There is no sense I can find in saying that there would be such a limit, and while Sailer may say outrageous things, he rarely says senseless ones. If you mean by "evolve" something like "be raised", then there are limits on how high IQs can "be raised" through the interventions that you said Sailer has mentioned. I'm not sure that it is even meaningful to talk about limits on how high a trait like IQ can "evolve".

Hence my confusion. Don't mean to be rude myself, but I'm still not sure that your question or point is even meaningful.

Anonymous said...

P.S. I should say that my favourite living writer, critic Harold Bloom, unlike you, doesn't seem to understand evolution at all, so this shouldn't be interpreted as an insult to your intellectual abilities.

Thursday

Alias Clio said...

Thursday, unless you want to re-open the argument, it's unwise to sign off a post by saying you might get attacked for it. I was angry last time we had "words" because you were extrapolating from the perfectly reasonable notion that women's characters and interests are conditioned by their biological role as nurturers to make unverifiable (and not esp. logical) assertions about the narcissism of the female sex in general.

Now, as to your main point, I'm perfectly willing to accept that I may have misunderstood something in Sailer, and I'm equally willing to admit that I have a very imperfect grasp of evolution. However, I'm not, contrary to Patrick's suggestion, getting confused about the distinction between "raising" IQ through intervention by improved diet and so forth, and the possibility that the IQ of a particular group might evolve over time to become higher. It was because I thought Sailer was saying the latter that I was baffled and annoyed. I repeat, I may have misunderstood what he meant, but I used to spend a good deal of time at his site. If I could find the passage again, or the passage I thought I saw, I might be able to determine whether I had in fact misinterpreted it.

Clio

Anonymous said...

I think there's some dispute about how much the average age of menarche has dropped over the last couple of hundred years. Claims range from about 4 years (16 > 12) to 1.5-2.0 years.

intellectual pariah

Alias Clio said...

I suspect that the reason there's some dispute about the drop in the average age at menarche is that it's something that's always been vulnerable to things like diet and the availability of fats and starches. Like height, it isn't a constant, but dependent on environmental considerations.

Clio

Anonymous said...

You know, just because a smarty wrote something doesn't me that he wasn't, you know, lying.

Or had no idea whatsoever what he was doing in the first place.

For example, those people with the genetic tendency to have as many kids as possible have had a very good century.

As a result, they are ludicriously over-represented in the current population.

People with inately lower fertility, thus able to ignore all the 'tricks', weren't quite able to multiply at the same rate.

MQ said...

I'm pretty sure the 1950s, which have done so much to create our imaginative picture of "ideal" family life, marked the *lowest* age at first marriage in all of American history. Not coincidentally, those marriages had a very high divorce rate in the 70s. (No time to get the stats for the 18th and early 19th century, but here it is for 1890-present: http://www.infoplease.com/ipa/A0005061.html). From some old econ history courses, I recall typical traditional marriage ages in agrarian America were 25-27 among males, 22-25 among females.

Also, Clio, stick to your guns on the IQ stuff. IQ is just a cultural marker with little scientific validity and no connection to morality. It's correlated to life success in a particular kind of organized, bureaucratized, technologically advanced society where the social order depends on manipulating abstractions. Such societies have done their fair share of butchery and massacre over the last few centuries.

Whiskey said...

I think everyone here is ignoring the ELEPHANT in the room: wealth.

Take the well known example of Ireland. In the late 1700's, before the famine, marriage occurred in the late teens and early twenties. Around 19-22 or so. After the famine, the records show delayed marriage into the mid thirties. People were simply too poor to get married.

Meanwhile, in the frontier in America, early marriage was the norm. Even in the Eastern part of Colonial America, men like John Adams married his wife (Abagail) when she was only 16. Davy Crockett's wife Polly was only 18 when she married him. Daniel Boone's wife was only 16 when she married him (he was 21).

When young men can afford to marry early, they DO. Why not? It

Alias Clio said...

I'm not ignoring the elephant in the room, Whiskey. I actually mentioned wealth in this post, although I didn't go into much detail about it, in part because I've done so before when blogging about this issue. But it was more complicated than "wealth" alone; after all, the ordinary people of India today are not rich, but they marry young and they always have. (Even in Alexander's time they were thought by the Greeks to marry off their sons rather young.) More important than "wealth" as such were land and space. For whatever reason, couples in north-western Europe historically wanted to move into houses of their own when they married, and it took time for them to earn enough money to be able to do so.

MQ said...

From Gloria Lund Main, "Peoples of A Spacious Land: Families and Cultures in Colonial New England", Harvard University Press, 2001, pp, 80-81:

"The mean age of marriage for sons hung steady at 26 through most of the colonial period....Marriage age for women was at a mean of 20.5 until 1675, then between 22 and 23 thereafter....almost 3-4ths of daughters marrying before 1675 was aged 22 or under, and one in ten was under the age of 18".

So even before 1675, when the age of marriage for women was unusually low, teenage brides were very unusual.

One thing to remember is that age of first menstruation was *much* higher in the past than it is in 20th century urban civilization. Something like 16 in the old days vs. 12-13 today.